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 Post subject: Re: "My Brother's keeper" Chapter 12: Red Sky at Mourning
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:23 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:19 am
Location: New York, NY
pluv wrote:
I liked the chapter. It had a good mix of action and dialogue. There were a couple of things that bugged me.

The airfield was supposed to be too cluttered with debris and we saw some of it but I was expecting smoke and blown up vehicles and just plain carnage all over the place. All we saw were a few bat parts laying around.

I also didn't like how Keel Haul would call the real life response a slap on the wrist. Navy/Air Force rivalry aside, I think even he would think four commanders being relieved and the entire wing losing their certification to ever touch those weapons again is a serious punishment.

While we aren't at the next chapter yet, I'm pretty sure that chopper makes it to the carrier. I'm also pretty sure any military pilot would take that thing down knowing what Cobra was planning. My he makes a move anyway and dies. That just makes WW decision to use him to begin with questionable.


This is what i love about Joe Customs, you guys really read this stuff.

Okay, where to begin, at the beginning.

Before the editing process, that Sergeant had more speaking parts during that scene which eluded to him being very afraid to report that he didn't have an answer for Cobra Commander. basically, he was making excuses. Sure there's a mess on the field but he was overexagerating. Unfortunately this wasn't as apparent as it should have been because his lines were rearranged.

Keel Haul, honestly, the reason for it is that when I wrote the script for this scene that had just happened and the Air Force had yet to lay blame on anyone. I dug up that article when responding to Midgarn. Before digging it up, memory left it as another military issue being left to the forgetful populace. It just wasn't front page news when they resolved it. At least I didn't see it. However you could write it off to Keel Haul feeling that that was a slap on the wrist.

As for the chopper. Let's keep that quiet for now. All I can say is that you'll be happy with the the next chapter and what happens. Trust me.


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 Post subject: Re: "My Brother's keeper" Chapter 12: Red Sky at Mourning
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:27 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:19 am
Location: New York, NY
General Hawk wrote:
Great stuff, Eric. The dialog and overall atmosphere is near perfect as usual, and the story flowed quite well. Your COBRA ship set is simply astounding. I can't wait until it's wrapped up, so I can go back and read the whole thing over again seamlessly.

Looking good, man.

Justin



Thanks, it'll probably make a lot more sense when it's all done, for now there are some issues everyone needs to trust me on but as you know, I put a lot of time into making these as real as they can be and although this has been 2 1/2 years in the making now, I honestly feel it will all be worth while in the end.

However, i doubt I'll ever commit to a project this big ever again. Unless I get a staff of people to help me with them.

Thanks again.


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 Post subject: Re: "My Brother's keeper" Chapter 12: Red Sky at Mourning
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 2:13 am 
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Thomas from Missourri

Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:19 am
It's a shame you're thinking of scaling back. It's the scope of your ambition and resultant work that never fails to wow me. You really have a massive and immersive dio world you're running, and it's heartily impressive.


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 Post subject: Re: "My Brother's keeper" Chapter 12: Red Sky at Mourning
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 2:35 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:19 am
Location: New York, NY
Spin Doctor wrote:
It's a shame you're thinking of scaling back. It's the scope of your ambition and resultant work that never fails to wow me. You really have a massive and immersive dio world you're running, and it's heartily impressive.


Well, I don't intend to stop making Dio's. I just can't imagine making one of this scope anymore. When I started MBK, I didn't have any kids and I just had my Day job and all this extra money to throw around every week. That's changed a lot now. I have two kids, in and out of night school/second job and making payments on all kinds of stuff. Life's changed quite a bit.

Operation Rapier was actually about 1/3 the size of MBK. There may have been more chapters but they were tiny in comparison to what I'm making now. This is why I can't get these up in any less than a month apart from each other, and usually more. The funny part is I still receive more praise over Operation Rapier than Brother's keeper. But I think that's because it's so large and over so much time that people forget too much of the story line.


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 Post subject: Re: "My Brother's keeper" Chapter 12: Red Sky at Mourning
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 2:37 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:19 am
Location: NJ
Eric,

Congrats on another great chapter in this dio run! The overall story and photo work are nicely done. I did have some questions though and maybe you can explain them to me.

At the safe house, there are 2 joe vehicles parked outside and General Hawk inside yet no visible perimeter watch. The Joes at the door appear to be caught off guard at the knock. Maybe a scene like them secretly tracking Faces approach from a mile off but letting him still pass would work better?

Regarding Faces, he's been undercover for 5 years but has never been disavowed until now? Usually that happens once an agent goes under under not during. I know police usually may stay tied to their units during a uc operation but don't intelligence operatives go in with the understanding their connection with the gov't is renounced?

As for the Night Viper, I completely understand your line of reasoning on the NV's hate and passion. However (based on the shot angle), Wreckage's back is turned directly to the NV standing behind him when the NV says he doesn't have a shot. That seems odd especially when Wreckage's body is covering the other NV's.

Then once again, the NV has another direct shot to Wreckage's back while standing but fails to take it. If the NV really wants to kill Wreckage, he wasted a lot of opportunity. Then the NV goes off on a Dr. Evil-type rant long enough for Aleph to come and save the day? Maybe there were some deleted scenes\lines to clarify or maybe I'm not reading it right?

Regarding the Televiper (based on the shot angle), why is the comm guy in front of all the other armed cobras. If they are worried about running into hostiles, wouldn't they protect him in the middle or rear. I know of some radio guys from Gulf 1 and Nam, they always told me that the radio guy is usually one of the first (if not the first) on the hit list.

My other question is about the Coast Guard support. I have never served in the Navy but the books, reports and press releases I have read to date do not support the Navy coming to the rescue of the CG especially during an apparent drug interdiction mission. The CG would get their own men to support. I have heard of the CG assistance flowing the Navy's way when inclement weather strikes the smaller Navy vessels. Also, CG cutters come equipped standard with 25 & 50 cal armaments, they wouldn't necessarily be outgunned.

That is why I think that even though the ship is under Cobra's secret direction, someone should at least have woken up Keel Haul to report it. Maybe a scene with him checking the cutter orders or nuke exercises would better demonstrate Cobra's complete control over the ship? Again, maybe there were a few deleted scenes or scenes to come which would better demonstrate this and we don't see it.

Thanks again for another great chapter.

_________________


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 Post subject: Re: "My Brother's keeper" Chapter 12: Red Sky at Mourning
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 10:51 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:19 am
Location: New York, NY
ronin wrote:
Eric,

Congrats on another great chapter in this dio run! The overall story and photo work are nicely done. I did have some questions though and maybe you can explain them to me.

At the safe house, there are 2 joe vehicles parked outside and General Hawk inside yet no visible perimeter watch. The Joes at the door appear to be caught off guard at the knock. Maybe a scene like them secretly tracking Faces approach from a mile off but letting him still pass would work better?

Regarding Faces, he's been undercover for 5 years but has never been disavowed until now? Usually that happens once an agent goes under under not during. I know police usually may stay tied to their units during a uc operation but don't intelligence operatives go in with the understanding their connection with the gov't is renounced?


There's only so many pictures I can fit in a chapter. This one already got away from me as is. Could there have been a perimeter guard? sure. But It's not something I was considering to add to the dio because i don't see how it took away from the experience by not having it.

As for the undercover bit. Up until this point he's been passing information to the Joes. This meeting is intended to do two things. one give him the chance to back out of a possible suicide mission and two, make him understand that there's no more communication. No orders, standing or otherwise. He's his own entity entirely. Which is very different from his original role.


ronin wrote:
As for the Night Viper, I completely understand your line of reasoning on the NV's hate and passion. However (based on the shot angle), Wreckage's back is turned directly to the NV standing behind him when the NV says he doesn't have a shot. That seems odd especially when Wreckage's body is covering the other NV's.

Then once again, the NV has another direct shot to Wreckage's back while standing but fails to take it. If the NV really wants to kill Wreckage, he wasted a lot of opportunity. Then the NV goes off on a Dr. Evil-type rant long enough for Aleph to come and save the day? Maybe there were some deleted scenes\lines to clarify or maybe I'm not reading it right?


I have to disagree. He's holding a HK- MP5K at two guys in the middle of a life or death fight. I can't show you how much these guys were probably rolling around but imagine someone just stabbed you in the back and tackeled you, I'm sure you'd be fighting back. So now you have this HK- MP5K (let's just say the full auto version) Sure he's got 2 and 3 burst option but still it's not like he can just aim and shot Wreckage in the head.

As for the knife fight. The idea is that he did shoot, but that Wreckage dodged just at the right time. if you didn't get that then that must be a failing of mine as a Dio-artist. That was the intention. Once his weapon was lost and and the knife was pulled, he was very confident and with good reason. You can see that he would have won easily without Aleph happening upon them. It's not like a deleted scene would explain this better. The fact is, he was very happy to be able to kill Wreckage in a more personal manner.

ronin wrote:
Regarding the Televiper (based on the shot angle), why is the comm guy in front of all the other armed cobras. If they are worried about running into hostiles, wouldn't they protect him in the middle or rear. I know of some radio guys from Gulf 1 and Nam, they always told me that the radio guy is usually one of the first (if not the first) on the hit list.


That Televiper is standing exactly where he has to in order to do his job. He's not going to stand in the back and out of earshot of the squad leader when that's the person that he needs to communicate with. He can't start yelling messages back and forth.

ronin wrote:
My other question is about the Coast Guard support. I have never served in the Navy but the books, reports and press releases I have read to date do not support the Navy coming to the rescue of the CG especially during an apparent drug interdiction mission. The CG would get their own men to support. I have heard of the CG assistance flowing the Navy's way when inclement weather strikes the smaller Navy vessels. Also, CG cutters come equipped standard with 25 & 50 cal armaments, they wouldn't necessarily be outgunned.

That is why I think that even though the ship is under Cobra's secret direction, someone should at least have woken up Keel Haul to report it. Maybe a scene with him checking the cutter orders or nuke exercises would better demonstrate Cobra's complete control over the ship? Again, maybe there were a few deleted scenes or scenes to come which would better demonstrate this and we don't see it.

Thanks again for another great chapter.


I don't know, I think you're really over analyzing now. I've never been in the Navy either but I would hope that if they received an order to assist the coast guard in a bad situation. An order that there's no reason to question, that they would go and help. And as for the Nuke, i think I explained that earlier in the Thread to Midgarn.

As for the CG ship, there was no coast guard ship. None of it was real, totally fabricated by Cobra. I have to leave it to your imagination as to what happened when that Rescue chopper arrived.


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 Post subject: Re: "My Brother's keeper" Chapter 12: Red Sky at Mourning
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 11:55 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:19 am
Location: NJ
Thanks for clearing some of that up. I think we all appreciate the type of dedication that you put into this and that you take time to shed light on stuff that isn't clear. Keep up the good work and we eagerly await the next chapter.

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