Here's a poser for everyone. In your Joe-verse, does Cobra have an internal system of military ranks, and if so, what are the rank titles?

I have been flirting with the idea myself, likening my three classes of trooper with three stages of enlisted: Blueshirts are privates and corporals, Python Patrol are lower NCOs (sergeants and specialists), and Crimson-level troopers are equivalent to higher NCOs (E-7 and up). Meanwhile, Crimson Guards run the gamut of officer grades, although the higher are reserved for Cobra High Command. (My WORMS from "Acceptable Losses" was a Captain, for instance -- I reclassified WORMS's as being CG first, then driver).

What I don't have yet are a real system of grades and titles, and I'd like to hear what's out there.

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I'm still working out my own, but I have always thought that the ranks should go over the different "branches" with certain minimum-rank requirements for the more elite sub-groups. Example (using army ranks):

Blue shirt = Private - Colonel (a good example is "Capt. Mitchell" from a great dio). Also, as a general rule I would think that on average an officer reaches a maximum rank of major before they transfer to a more elite unit.

Viper(i.e. televiper,neoviper,etc) = all ranks with a minimum of a corporal/specialist or E-4 to join.

I would say that once they at least reach Colonel+ they would be a "named character" at least - in other words, getting that high, you're going to be named just by the fact that you are one of the few higher ranks.

Crimson Guards - these guys I thought were different, I think of them as a rank within a rank so to speak. I would think of them kind of like the gestapo. The gestapo had majors, colonels, etc etc - and yes regular army outranked them - but no regular general wanted to ever cross a gestapo. I would say that Crimson Guardsmen have a minimum rank before be chosen of E-5 OR have shown extreme skill, courage, etc.

I hope that helps some

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Instead of rank perse I made an org chart...thanks for the headache...turns out the twins are running just about everything, but Cobra really needs an Naval and Airforce commander, cause Coperhead is just a Lt. and well WW is a subcontractor.

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Short question, long answer.

My COBRA Command is basically 10 armies, each with 10 Legions. CC's ranked no higher than any of the other Watch Commanders, but has more 'pull' due to having created his army first (and thus always manages to have more troopers) and more 'force of personality'. There's always infighting amongst the Watch Commanders, but CC manages to keep a majority of them under his sway, usually.

Each of the WCs are themselves members of the Crimson Guard, and have 9 subordinate CGs in their Watches. Each CG keeps a private mercenary army of at least 1,000 men in his employment (for a grand total of at least 100,000 troopers in COBRA Command overall). Each CG has their own way of organizing their armies, but they follow a general trend. Other than the Crimson Guard, there are generally no other officers in COBRA. Bludd is specially-hired to run CC's Recruit training.

The Armies are broken up into 'gangs', of a sort. Troopers feel a loyalty to their unit and their CG-in-command; but not necessarily to COBRA as a whole. Their income is usually obtained by plundering whatever territories they conquer, along with some bank robbing, credit card fraud, ebay scams, etc. They keep what they kill, more or less. Income is ultimately the responsibility of one's CG, and there are defections to other CGs if yours can't keep the green rolling in.

As I'm an ex-Squid, I know Naval rankings best and think the philosophy works well. There are 9 ranks in the Enlisteds, broken into 3 groups of three. The Seamen are the grunts/trainees; the Petty Officers are the middle management/specialists; and the Chiefs are the field commanders.

So, keeping that general idea in mind; I've got this for my Viper ranks:

E1 - Viper Recruit, basic grunt right off the street. Vipers and Blueshirts are identical, just wearing diff uniforms dependant on whatever their duties are that day.
E2 - Viper Apprentice, the so-called 'Viper Officers'. They've basically been in COBRA for 3 months and have gotten a pay raise; but aside from the silver rank insignia there's little difference.
E3 - Viper First Class, where a Viper chooses a field specialty. They're generally at this rank for 6-9 months, sometimes popping around from manning the stations on a Moray ro doing field support for tanks or refueling the planes.

E4 - ****-Vipers/Raptor/Eel, this is where the specialties come into play. The HEAT Vipers, Flak Vipers, this is where you would become an Eel or Raptor if you choose aquatic or aerial specialties.
E5 and E6, there's no change in name or uniform; just greater pay with greater time in service and experience.

E7-E9; Frankly, there's so few Vipers that make it to these ranks that there's little known about them. Most have either retired with a tidy stash in a Swiss or Caymans acct, or been killed in service. However, they would function similarly to Warrant Officers, implementing the long term plans of their immediate CG superior.

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I am sure I forgot some people:

Cobra commander is the top tier
Tier 2: Are CC’s Generals and has the Baroness, Storm Shadow (who is a Cobra) the Twins and Mindbender (who is not dead in my world)
Tier 3: would the Colonel and Independent contractors such as Destro, Firefly, Major Blud, Wild Weasel and Zartan, who although report directly to CC are still hired guns, this tire also has Cesspool and Overlord who report to the twins, Crystal Ball who report to the Baroness, and finally Overkill who reports to Mindbender.

Tier 4: Majors – Interrogator, who reports to Crystal Ball, Slice and Dice who report to Storm Shadow, the CG’s who report to directly to the Twins, Dr. Know and Dr. Scalpel both reporting to Mindbender.

Tier 5: Ninjas who report to Slice and Dice, the entire Python patrol report to the CG’s ( I see this as a transition period for a CG)

Tier 6: Lt.’s Blackout who reports to Cobra Commander Copperhead, Big Boa and general Cobra officers who report to Overlord , Neurotoxin, Coil Crusher, Razorclaw all report to Mindbender Medivipers who report Scalpel. Dreadnoks would fit in here of course reporting to Zartan and all Pilots / Specialty flying Vipers would be here too reporting to Wild Weasel.
Tier 7: Tele Vipers report directly to the Baroness, Lampreys report to Copperhead (he is a little smarter in my world) Specialty Viper Drivers report to cobra officers Headman reports to Cesspool Techno Vipers report to Overkill.

Tier 8: Eels (Electric Eels), Sea Slugs, Snow Serpents and Morays report to Lampreys, Specialty Vipers report to Cobra Officers.
Tier 9: Vipers / Blue shirts report to one of the following, Cobra Officers or Specialty Vipers (depending on assignment, but may report directly up to CC) Head Hunters report to Headman
Tier 10: BATS who “report” to Overkill

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Thanks for the info, all. Now, rather than think of the overarching structure, let's focus on the titles.

AdrienVeldt shows that he's using "Viper" instead of "Private." This is the kind of thing I'm interested in -- would you call a "Sergeant" a "Sergeant", or a "Petty Officer" (to look at our real world armed forces for an example. Or, think of how we call Army E-1's Privates, Navy Seamen, and Air Force Airmen.

In mine, someone may be a "blueshirt," but that means more that they are untrained -- think DTC Cobra Troopers, not 25th Anniversary / original uniforms. Cobra personnel wearing /those/ are more like the Class A's in my mind.

But, back to the rank titles. Are there rank titles used for other countries' armed forces that sound especially appropriate for use in Cobra, particularly in officer-land? The standard "lieutenant -captain -major -colonel -general" seems really pedestrian. Besides, Major Bludd has an increased prominence within my Cobra, so I plan on relabeling "Major" as O-5 or O-7 to reflect that.

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In the Navy, the first 3 enlisted ranks are named Seaman, Fireman, or Airman, with the assumption that once you go E4 and select a specialty it'll be in line with those rough groups. Seamen are all the obvious ship-related specialties (Quartermaster, Boatswain, etc) plus the general-purpose specialties like Corpsman and Mess Specialist. Firemen are the Engineering specialties like Damage Controlman and Machinist's Mate. Airmen are the flight-related guys like Aviation Ordnanceman and Aircrew Survival Equipmentman.

For my COBRA Command, I use a similar philosophy but break it down by theatre of war; Vipers for Land, Eels for Aquatic, and Raptors for Aerospace (altho that one's a recent divergence from the main Viper rating in my verse and still an incomplete break). This is causing me some headaches as I'll need to rename a lot of guys to align with this. Strato-Raptors, Gyro-Raptors, etc. I've already established that the Hydro-Viper program has been discontinued, so I thankfully can say that came before the -Raptor designation and not have to name somebody a 'Hydro-Eel'.

The term 'Blueshirt' is not an official rank or specialty, similarly to how 'CrackerJacks' isn't a Naval rank. It's just a nickname given to refer to the lower ranks based on their uniform.

In the Navy, once one becomes E4 or higher, you and your rank can be called either the general 'Petty Officer Second Class' or the more specific name of your rating, such as 'Cryptologic Technician Second Class' or 'CT2' for brevity. I think this second option is what COBRA does, simply referring to guys as 'HEAT-Viper Specialist' and 'Tele-Viper Corporal', to swap it back over to Army terminology.

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Ahhh... Yep, I'm a nerd about this... I did up a Cobra Order of Battle for my forces. Since in my 'verse every Cobra does infantry training before specialising (even before going into an environment - i.e. Naval or Air Forces) I started with the Ground Forces. The ranks are as shown here:


This powerpoint shows how rank structure and tiers fit into the larger picture of the Cobra organisation. In simple terms, you earn the designation Viper once you complete phase two infantry training - i.e. elementary offensive tactics. Those who don't stay on defensive duties as 'Blueshirts'.

Would love to hear any comments!

-= =-

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My idea is that blueshirts are at the bottom, and that there are different blueshirts that do jobs that will "evolve" into specialty vipers. An example would be a tele-viper would start off as a blueshirt that would be an understudy of a viper, and working as part of the Cobra Island Parcel Service or something in communication, like admining a website that spreads Cobra ideas.

Once they make it to Viper status, they are supposed to train blueshirts and work in their assigned area of work. This is the next rank up.

The troops that aren't Vipers or Blueshirts such as Sand Scorpions and Night Creepers are the next rank up.

Then the Crimson Guard.

Then Cobra would have an "Inner Circle" which consists of the major players.

The rank would be as follows:

Cobra Commander

Baroness and Destro

Dr. Mindbender, Overkill, Serpentor, Zartan, and others.

Anyone that was an associate of Cobra would go here.

Then everyone else that is important.

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My problem with this thinking is that y'all think 'Blueshirts' is an actual title for these guys. Like it's a term that would show up on their paychecks or something. I think 'Blueshirts' is something derogatory, used either within the COBRA ranks as a bit of hazing or by the Joes (or even both). Just like I don't see Hitler ever calling his guys 'Brown Shirts', I don't see CC calling his troopers 'Blueshirts'. It just doesn't sound like an official rank or term, imho.

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Well that's a very interesting take on the training and organization of Cobra. It is very very detailed and I found it interesting (especially the color rank/mask/shoulder board break down). Nice work on it.

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What happen to your website StarViper

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In my joeverse, Cobra is set up more like a real military where rank is irrevelent to being a speciality viper. Though the crimson guard are an exception, which are all at least the equivilant of a colonel. For instance an blueshirt officer would still be able to give orders to an enlisted EEl.

The only qualification is some of the specialty viper groups require a minium time of service or previous experience in a foreign military. While a recruit could become a stinger driver after completing basic training , he may have to wait a few years to be an alley viper.

Basically the command structure i use is first Cobra Commander, the the various other named cobra's are like generals over their specific areas, then it becomes a normal military structure. Well except for sand scorpions and toxo vipers. And i use blueshirts and vipers interchangeably with the viper outfit as a battle uniform and blueshirt is a normal around the terrordrome look.

A guy on hisstank did up some cobra unit patches for his different divisions

http://www.hisstank.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8154

I always liked the rank structure of the Roman Legions for my Cobras they just seem to fit very well with Cobra and it includes designations for non soldiers, recruits and an organizational structure.

http://www.unrv.com/military/legion.php

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