Sorry to go slightly OT, but I know what you mean. I've Cherokee in me, going back to my Great-great-grandparents, I think, but I'd never think of claiming to be one. Conversely, there are people like the bitter old crone I see driving around here (unobservant of other traffic, cuts people off), who has fair skin and blonde hair, yet proudly displays the dreamcatcher and all this other stuff on her dashboard and rearview, and has a bumper sticker with native imagery and the words, "We were here first, so why don't you illegal aliens go home". I find that sort of behavior more belittling of the native tradition over any action figure I've seen.

Yep, I see a lot of that myself. Here in Louisiana, you see lots of stuff you wouldn't think you'd see on a daily bases. Go over to Dallas and you see that Texan wearing the full suit with cowboy hat, spurs, and bolo tie driving a Cadillac with long horns hood ornament.

Spirit is pretty believable to me to wear what he wears. I take it that he's near or is full blooded Native American, so he just has his own way to reflect it. I think a lot of people that live around Arizona and such could add some info on it. I've been out there and saw lots of things that I thought was just sterotypes and exaggerations.

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I finally figured out what the designer was trying to do with Spirit's left hand:

Its to replicate the card art pose, touching the ground looking for tracks.

- JM

Live in Arizona, work across the street from the reservation, play sports with several Native Americans - and I've never anyone dressed like Spirit. My problem with Spirit is just too many of these "stereotypes" in one pacakge - arrow-shooting rifle, ponytails, loincloths, fringes, eagles, etc.

It would have been nice to see Hasbro tone some of it down, but this is the 25th Anniv line. So, they recreated the original figure. Best I can do is not buy the figure if I don't approve of it.

I live like 15 minutes from an Indian reservation and many of the people living there do wear feathers in their hair, skin shirts, aprons, moccasins, beads and the like.

It all comes down to personal preference.

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I don't know If I was coming across as mad, but I really wasn't; that's the problem with "Discussion" forums. Lack of environmental cues. In any case, I can see where you're coming from with relation to "Stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason." I get that, really I do. I'm actually only third(?) gen off the boat from Ireland, and believe me I can see a lot of truth AND humor AND bile in the stereotypes most commonly associated with the Irish. (c'mon, you didn't think my name is Mick, did you?) I think where I draw the line for myself, in the case of the characterizations we talked over last night is that they are piled on too thick, and to me they detract from what the concept of the team is. In Spirit's case, like I said, I think they piled up too much stuff, and it became overkill. One or two of the elements, and it would have been an expression of identity on par with the other members of the team, adding a unique look and easily relatable feel, while being respectful. All together, it was just too over the top and jarring for me. I feel the same way about Quick Kick..

I also considered while I was at work today that what I said last night might make some wonder if the stuff bugs me that much, why bother collecting, customizing, yakking on boards about it? Eh, what can I say, I've mellowed with age, and a lot of the things that bugged me then don't anymore. There are just a couple that do, and this is one of them.


Even If I can accept his outfit being an homage to the Indian Scouts of the Indian Wars and Punitive Expeditions, much like Wild Bill's first outfit was homage to the cav troopers of the same era, an idea I don't doubt at all, I will never have anything good to say about that gun. Except maybe that as stupid as it is, the twenty fifth version with the removable clips was well done.

The difference is that in operational settings like Iraq and Afghanistan, there are all types of considerations for them to wear and groom themselves that way, ranging from Humint, psyops, and SERE, all the way to logistics concerns. However, those same operators adhere to military standards when NOT in operational settings. Then again, maybe he just didn't like your 2LT.

But other than Dress Blues BungHo, are any of our Joes supposed to be in non-combat outfits? These are supposed to be them when they're out on-op, right?

Would we be having this same discussion if they made a kilted Destro fig, I wonder? Or maybe Storm Shadow in a kimono? Or CrossCountry in ... well, all he's really missing is a fishing pole and a beer can.

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A kilted Destro fig wouldn't be all that goofy. A shirtless, kilted (with no underwear) Destro all painted up like Mel Gibson in Braveheart with a shaggy beard hanging out from under the mask and a caber to toss at his enemies instead of a gun would be.

Actually, I kind of like the sound of that one.

Man I soo regret not posting this months ago when I had all the info in front of me.

SPIRIT's uniform, his pony tails, everything is an homage to an Indian character, "Sergent Hawk" on the very popular longest running television Western (20 years) Gunsmoke. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0594139/

Now that I'm looking for it, I can't find a picture, but this Indian had a white mother who refused to acknowledge he was her son because she had been kidnapped by Indians as a teenager and he was the result of her young forced marriage. Flash forward twenty years into the future and he's now a tracker for the US Army (epsiode guide says he was a reservation sheriff, so I may be wrong there) and she lives alone with her two young children from her second marriage (to a white gu after she escaped the Indians).

"Sergent Hawk" wore the blue shirt with red chevrons on the sleeve and "native american looking" pants and boots, I want to say even the loin cloth but I can't guarantee that. In this episode, he fights off some braves who are trying to attack his mother's home. He gets shot, so her other children (much younger) take him in to treat him. She refuses to help him and refuses to acknowldge he's her son. Eventually she feels compelled to explain to her daughter about her history. They help aide Sergent Hawk back to health and he rides off with his fellow rough riders.

Personally, I think the arrow gun is genious. As a tracker he'd want to be stealthy. It's like an advanced version of Scarlet's crossbow.

I don't think the Indian look is meant to be offensive, of course that's easy for my Irish ass to say. They released a non-sterotype Native American the year before, so it's not like they implied, if he's Indian he has to look like an "indian" - I think they just had fun with the designs, and probably were big fans of Gunsmoke growing up.

-CJack

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If he's going to be stealthy, then why not a BOW, or even a CROSSbow. It can't be that stealthy, it's a gun. What actually propels the Arrows? Chemical propellant? compressed gas? Anything that pushes the arrows through the barrel hard enough to make them effective is going to make a damn big racket. You ever fire a potato gun?

Oh, and don't get me wrong, I've admitted that I don't think that they were TRYING to be offensive. I do however think that they were trying to come up with a design that said INDIAN in bold letters. One of the other posters in the thread admitted he had no idea initially Airborne was supposed to be Native American, since noone had told him.

[quote="ThMick"]If he's going to be stealthy, then why not a BOW, or even a CROSSbow, It can't be that stealthy, it's a gun.

Why not a bow or cross bow? Cause the were using their imagination.

I don't think it would be gunpowder charged, probably spring loaded. A modern version would be CO2 powered.

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Both of which would make a lot of noise, much more noise than a bow or crossbow.

I'm Taliesin Crow, 1/2 Cherokee, and I approve this figure.

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That's not saying much,

TC is half of everything.

'Cept maybe lawn gnomes.

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